Wednesday, January 16, 2008

Fashionably Bi

Jay at Cynical Bastard said...
Seems like more and more women are claiming to be bi these days. Do you think they really are, or do you think most of them are just "fashionably bi?" Hell, do you even believe that any person really is bi or do you believe we are either straight or gay?



I think more people are more comfortable exploring their sexuality than ever before because they HEAR/SEE it on the tube. In 1997, Ellen came out becoming the first out lesbian on TV on her sitcom. Plus she kissed another woman!!!! That was the first time that I remember seeing anything like that. It was such a big deal that we had a big ol' lesbian party over it and watched it all lumped up together!

So, I don't think that they're fashionably bi. I think that they're falling in the middle of the Kinsey Scale and that society is such now that they can explore how they feel.

I think that people fall all over the scale from Totally Queer to Totally Straight. I'm pretty queer. After I had one full on girl kiss....I only went back to boys once. And it was to piss Michele off. Oh, and it really did! There's something about boys that flips out some butch girls. I guess it's a competitive thing. But I would have screwed a girl if I had had that option...you know, to piss her off. My 16 year old mind wasn't that sophisticated, mkay?

However, there are some women that do it for attention from men. I have noticed them goofing off and kissing other girls. That's just stupid.

What do the rest of you think?

60 comments:

i am the diva said...

you can't walk into a bar or club without seeing two ladies makin' out for drinks. i think that's just sad.

i'm glad you mentioned the Kinsey scale.

Also, it was a great film.

Dana said...

I could do an entire blog post on my opinion, but I'll try to make it brief.

I think there *is* a "fashionably bi" segment of the population. My experience is that they tend to be women under 30 who know this is a turn-on for men AND women and since society is far more accepting of it, they "toy" with it for a period of time.

I also think there is a rather significant population of women (usually over 30) who fall somewhere in the 4/5 range of the Kinsey scale, but who have "settled" for a heterosexual relationship to meet the traditional wife/mother expectations of society.

Tink said...

I can honestly say I'm strictly dickly. I experimented with kissing girls when I was a teen. Mostly it was due to being really really stoned or drunk. But it never quite "did" it for me. So I'm a believer that people prefer one or the other. You can try and fool yourself into loving the sex that you don't, but in the end you know what you like.

Diva said...

I think there's both fashionably bi and really bi when not out and about and trying to con some brother out of drinks.

Some girls dig chicks and dicks.

Jen said...

In brief:

This chick digs dick. But that's not to say that I didn't kiss a girl back in my early 30's. . . she had soft lips - a soft kiss. I liked the kiss and the girl was smoking hot, but it didn't do anything for me. I had no electrical shivers that I got when I kissed a man. I wasn't trying to be gay or fashionable. I just always wanted to kiss a girl. It never went any further. But she never stopped calling me and asking if I'd sleep with her. I never did. I don't regret that - maybe if she'd caught me in my younger more fearless days. . .

R.E.H. said...

Wow... this is... wow.

I wish I knew how to respond here, but I'm really lost for words to be honest.

Yes, I believe that some people are genuinely bi, of course. But, I also think there are many out there who are "fashionably bi", or even "fashionably gay".

While television may allow people to explore their sexuality, because being gay is not frowned upon like it was in the 80's and early 90's... that part is a good thing.

But, I am also of the opinion that there is too much of it out there for the very young to watch, which is why (I believe) many feel they have to explore that, because it is what they're supposed to do... making them "fashionably bi/gay".

Jay said...

Not only has this been a really civil discussion it's been pretty interesting.

I agree with everybody really.

I think there are people who are really bi and I believe that there are a lot of people who are just fashionably bi. I especially believe that most of the "bi" chicks you see on MTV are just "fashionable bi"

There are a lot of people who are just really hedonistic and love to have sex with people of both sexes. And then there are people who have genuine sexual and emotional attraction to people of both sexes.

Funny how everybody really kept the discussion on women though, huh?

Real Live Lesbian said...

Diva: True, but that's not what I consider bi. That's just kids being kids.

Dana: I totally agree and I think society's relaxation will be a good thing for them.

Tink: I agree...that's why it's hard for me to believe that some folks do it fashionably. Maybe I'm way gay, but kissing boys is just icky.

Diva: True, very true.

Jen: I too can physically kiss a guy, but it just does nothing for me. She's probably STILL thinking about you!

REH: It's hard for me to believe that someone would choose to be bi or gay. I really think being bi is worse.

~Deb said...

I dated this girl once, who was a spitting image of Britney Spears. We met the old fashioned way - through the personals in the newspaper. I was kind of in the closet still and didn't know how to meet other lesbians. Anyway, we met, but she DID NOT even give one vibe that she was "gay". I thought she must be bi. But, what I found out was, she did it to get men's attention. At clubs and bars, she would try to kiss me in front of them, in order to obtain their numbers, (which I soon found out later on), and eventually, I was left out in the cold because she started dating a man.

Ironic part: she turned into a real wacky born again Christian who went celibate.

Hrmm.

I enjoyed reading this post!

Jay Cam said...

"I have noticed them goofing off and kissing other girls. That's just stupid."

lol no offence or anything but that's not the opinion of a whole bunch of guys!

Jahooni said...

Oh wow. Hymnnn.... I can't stand to see the little tramps at the bar kissing on their girlfriends, etc. just to get the attention of men.
I say if your gay your gay. So be it. I just don't get whole bi thing. I don't know... it's just me. I have never been turned on by a woman. I LOVE men way way too much. Seems that Bi, you would 'prefer" one or the other, so the one you "prefer" makes you either straight or gay. Right?

Southern Sage said...

hmmm
I have always thought chicks we more predisposed to be bi, why I haven't a clue. I have been involved twice with chicks who were having their first time bi experience and they appeared to be all in. Maybe females are more open minded or something. I can't fathom how a guy could ever be with a girl and then be with a guy and say "hmmmm now this sure is a toss up" I think I'd fall sqaurely in the "I dig chicks only" camp.
SS

RockDog said...

First off, can someone please tell me the addresses of these bars where chicks are making out? I mean, for research purposes...

Secondly, how funny is it that I read the title of this post and saw a picture of Jay. I was wondering if he had proclaimed his "bi-ness" or something... LOL!

Real Live Lesbian said...

Deb: Just be glad it wasn't the real Brit.

Jay: Yeah, yeah...I know.

Jahooni: Prefer, yes, but I think some folks are closer to the middle of the scale than I am. It just makes sense that the middle wouldn't be void of people.

SS: Excellent point. Really.

Rockdog: I'll let you know if I find out something new about Jay's sexuality! Too funny!

TheBirdman33 said...

I fall on the extremely straight side of the scale lol but I think you are right....people may fall in different parts of that scale but ultimately they are born either straight or gay.

You can Call me AL said...

Well, I'm TRISexual, I'll try anything! BUT I do have one rule, NO DICK! That makes me a man lesbian.
Woman on woman, really not for me. Two women and myself ? No Thanks, been there done that and didn't like it.
Give me ONE woman that I want to please and care for, that is good loving.

motherx said...

I think there are girls who will just pretend to be bi for male attention, which Ive always thought pretty dumb. In my experience someone who is truly bi will be more inclined to keep it hidden...unless they make up their mind to do something about it. Btw, what is it with girls called Michelle?? a certain person will always spring to mind! Ha! But going back to the plot...yes I think you can like both!

em said...

I think that most people are not on extreme ends of the Kinsey scale but somewhere in the middle. I don't have anything to base that on, it is just my opinion. But, it is certainly trendy for women to say they are 'bi'.

I would not consider myself 'bi' because I am much more attracted to men then women, but I think sex with a woman would be very nice. I haven't had the opportunity, but I'd take it if I got it.

Also even if people are just 'fashionably bi' I say, who cares. Let them have fun.

Interesting topic!

buffalodickdy said...

I really don't enjoy watching anybody make out with anybody in a public place- and I truly don't care who or what they do in private!

Biscuit said...

Dana said exactly what I was thinking, so thank you, hon! :)

I don't think having it "out there" in the media is any different than having heterosexual relationships displayed. It certainly doesn't make me popular with the other parents, but I have no intention of presenting one alternative as "normal." My life is filled with friends who cover the spectrum, and I won't dance around it with my kids.

BarnGoddess said...

I also agree that there are people who are "fashionably bi" AND just "bi".

I know only women who are bi, if any of my guy friends are they certainly arent sharing it with me.

Women are beautiful. I enjoy looking at a beautiful woman but never really had any desire to have sex with one. I also like looking at men, A LOT......

re:below post
cavenders ROCKS!! it's one of the best cooking spices I have ever used.

Southern Sage said...

Really?
haaaaaaaa
your reply made me laugh.

Real Live Lesbian said...

Birdman: Being extremely gay...I totally get you.

Al: If you aren't already snagged up by some lucky woman..watch out...talking like that will get you married!

Motherx: You're probably right. The true angst about being bi would scare me into silence. Especially during the time when I was growing up.

Em: IT IS REALLY NICE!!!!

Buff: Me neither. Straight OR gay...take that shit home.

Biscuit: I don't either. Otherwise, seeing all those straight folks growing up would have turned me straight. Plus, I was RAISED by straight people.

Barngoddess: I feel the same way about men. Some of 'em have lovely bodies, I just don't want to have sex with them. Doesn't make them any less lovely.

SS: What's so funny????? ;)

Matt-Man said...

The bottom line is that Jay is fashionably Bi. He makes me swoon. Cheers!!

Alli said...

I would have to agree with the masses here. I think there are truly "bi" and the "I am just doing this b/c it's trendy or maybe it'll turn guys on." Isn't the later so weird. Many straight men get turned on by watching women getting it on but I dare say most straight women DO NOT want to see 2 men making getting it on or even making out. Bleh! Isn't it weird how that works?

OK, now here comes the animal behaviorist in me. Most animals have what is commonly referred to as homosexual (or bisexual) tendencies and this is considered normal. So, why can't that be true for humans? Yes, we are much more evolved, but we are still animals and still have primal instincts. Right? So perhaps it is very normal for humans to also have bisexual tendencies or at the very least, curiousity.

I'm just sayin...

~Deb said...

Believe me - it was probably even worse!!! haha!

Real Live Lesbian said...

Matt: Jay makes us all swoon. Step in line.

Alli: I think I know her! LOL

Cynnie said...

I played with gay back in the 80's..
actually, i just fell in love..she happened to be a girl.

Tequila Mockingbird said...

i like your take on this. i SO hate those silly little chicks at the bar who make out with other girls to turn on their boyfriend; it's false advertising. i like to call their bluff and turn it up a notch with some groping. usually weeds out the fakers right quick.

Gledwood said...

o darling girls can get away with it, boys can't as it implies being sodded up the poo-hole

ho-hum

if you want a laugh click on my post today's right at the end past Laundretta to what she laughed at the Brazillian bysexual boyfriend marco affair ting real funny!!

Diva said...

Hmm. I wanted to keep me out of it, but I don't think tip-toeing around helped me say what I was trying to say.

Preposterous Ponderings said...

Ha ha ha ha love the title with Jays picture next to it! Perfect!

I believe that there are people who like the best of both worlds.

Think about it.Would you eat a cookie and not go for the cream as well? Point proven! :o)

Now go have an Oreo......

motherx said...

Id describe being Bi as frustrating. (emm so Ive heard!) xx

coffeypot said...

I have heard the term, BUG - Bi Until Graduation, use in the high schools. It keeps the girls from being tempted or having to put up with the bull shit of high school boys, yet gives them a release for their emotions and desires. Yet, after they graduate, they revert back to males. What do you think?

coffeypot said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Hot Lemon said...

mmmm... this fence feels nice.

tt said...

Interesting...
very interesting....my 'youngin' tried to convince herself she was Hetro...she even got engaged to a guy...luckily she called it off before the wedding. She's much happier now that she's honest w/ herself,I think.

Siren said...

Um... We exist. I promise.

I am bi. I am attracted to men and women pretty equally. Except for one notable exception, every serious grown-up relationship I have had has been with another bisexual person.

I'm no fan of trendy bisexuality. It makes it harder for people to believe that real bisexuality is possible.

Jeff B said...

I'm a little late getting into the fray here, but what a great disscussion.

I think you make a good point about people feeling more open to explore their sexuality these days, but I really beleive there is a certain segment of individuals who choose an orientation to fit in with a particular social group they want to be a part of.

A lot of people wear "masks" to blend in to a clique or a group that is getting attention. The media has enabled the gay and lesbian communities to be more open lately and as a result, people are more willing than ever to experiment whether or not their bent that way.

I tread lightly with that last statement because I know there is still a hell of a lot of descrimination going on, so please know that I don't think America has arrived in its complete acceptance by any means.

Diane J Standiford said...

I am bi-man trapped in a woman's body who has been happily monogomous with a bi-woman for 28yrs, but my favorite is the female form. Seems we are talking sexually-speaking only, to say something is done for fashion is like saying something done to be PC. My gay friends hate bisexuals. So...my opinion is no, yes, no, no, no, yes, yes, maybe. (And sometimes Why?)

The Mistress of the Dark said...

Well then there's Anne Heche...who I believe just wanted publicity. It's hard to judge the hollywood types.

Though its also hard to say why people are attracted to people and if its because they want to fit into a certain crowd or if they truly are attracted to both sexes.

Real Live Lesbian said...

Cynnie: I thought that's what happened to me. But turns out, I really really like girls. ;)

Tequila: Which bar do you go to?

Gled: THAT was funny!

Diva: Tiptoeing never works.

PP: Just give me a cookie and I'm perfectly happy!

Motherx: LMAO...yeah, right.

Coffee: I've never heard of that! WTF???

Hotlemon: You just sit right there.

TT: It's easier just to be who you are.

Siren: You are very right. It does.

Jeff: I guess it's really no different than me experimenting to see if I liked boys. But that wasn't really experimenting, I just didn't know about the alternative.


Diane: You just made my brain explode. I'll have to go look up your answers! :)

Mistress: Rolls eyes at Anne Heche.

MICKY said...

Over 3 years ago I dropped into a black hole – four months of absolute terror. I wanted to end my life, but somehow [Holy Spirit], I reached out to a friend who took me to hospital. I had three visits [hospital] in four months – I actually thought I was in hell.

I imagine I was going through some sort of metamorphosis [mental, physical & spiritual]. I had been seeing a therapist [1994] on a regular basis (Family of Origin & EMDR), up until this point in time. I actually thought I would be locked away – but the hospital staffs were very supportive [I had no control over my process]. I was released from hospital 16th September 2004, but my fear, pain & shame had only subsided a little.

I remember this particular morning waking up [home] & my process would start up again [fear, pain, & shame]. No one could help me, not even my therapist [I was terrified]. I asked Jesus Christ to have mercy on me & forgive me my sins. Slowly, all my fear has dissipated & I believe Jesus delivered me from my “psychological prison.”

I am a practicing Catholic & the Holy Spirit is my friend & strength; every day since then has been a joy & blessing. I deserve to go to hell for the life I have led, but Jesus through His sacrifice on the cross, delivered me from my inequities. John 3: 8, John 15: 26, are verses I can relate to, organically.


He's a real person who is with me all the time. I have so much joy & peace in my life to day - after a childhood spent in orphanages. God loves me so much. Fear, pain & guilt are no longer my constant companions. I just wanted to share my experience with you (Luke 8: 16-17).

I, MICKY, AM THE HOLY ONE OF GOD

Seraphine said...

It's hard enough finding an acceping peer group when one is married, so yes 'fashionably bi' works.

Slick said...

Bi or not....

I like movies.

Does this answer your question?

Real Live Lesbian said...

Micky: I'm a Christian, too. I guess that's what my next blog will be about!

Seraphine: Whatever works!

Slick: No, not really. But hi!

coffeypot said...

This is what Wikipedia says about BUG:

The slang terms lesbian until graduation (LUG), bisexual until graduation (BUG) or more recently myspace bisexual, [1] are terms used to describe women primarily of high-school or college age, who are assumed to be experimenting with or with adopting a temporary lesbian or bisexual identity. The term suggests that the woman to whom it is applied will ultimately adopt a strictly heterosexual identity.

The term is largely considered pejorative in the LGBT community.

Additionally some members of the lesbian community use this term to disparage bisexual women.[2]

fathorse said...

hmm, crazy - I was just debating this (sort of, well I was, I don't know about the others) over at http://909highst.blogspot.com/

There must be something in the air, non?

Vixen said...

I did a post on my blog a bit ago regarding this topic. Fashionably bi is def the 'new thing'. It's 'trendy' to be bi these days. And the even newer trend/cool thing after that is bdsm.
*rolling eyes*

SagaciousHillbilly said...

I had a numberof women tell me they are not bi or gay, but once-in-a-while they like to make it with a woman. Breaks up the boredom.

The question is; why are men so adament about being straight. You'll never hear a straight man say "oh, I like to do a man once-in-a-while to break up the boredom in my life." Nope, us straight men are repulsed by the thought. Obviously WE are the ones who a oppressed! ; )
Todd Rundgren once said that utopia won't be acheived until everyone is bi.

jGrrl said...

This is an incredibly thought provoking post. I have to say that I have seen a lot of people in my city jumping on the "bi bandwagon" and many of them are obviously playing it for shock value...

I like men and women in completely different ways when it comes to the physical side, I'd even hazard to say that sexually - women are much more pleasant to me which is not to say that I don't enjoy sex with a man, I'm married to one now...

I find the connection is different with both but even then - for me - I fall in love or like or whatever and its almost like I totally disregard the plumbing. Its just an added bonus that I enjoy physical intimacy with both. I almost "forget" whats in their pants and I only see their thoughts and how they treat me and how they treat themselves. Flaky maybe but I like to think I first care for them, their heart and soul, and then I simply show it with the body physical later.

I grew up attracted to both from a very young age. My mom had a lot of Gay and Lesbian friends and as I got older and tried to ask questions - they assured me that you can't be both, thats just confusion and if you like girls at all then you'll one day realize that you're totally Gay.

I had so much love and respect for these people, they babysat me and they loved me like I was their own kid and they're telling me that I'm just confused, I was a mess from that but I know they were only trying to help.

When I was 19, I had my first real girlfriend and it snowballed overnight from a few kisses to a torrid affair that lasted, off and on, for a few years. I still think of her often and I've had a few girlfriends since.

When I "came out" as bi, a lot of my friends told me they were happy that I finally realized it and I was stunned. Here I thought I was demented and my straight friends were so supportive, they counselled me through it. I love them for that, truly.

Over the years I've had a handful of people gossip or mouth off nut for the most part I've had it good.

Loads of my fully Gay friends have been beaten, abused and horribly harassed.

I was bi before it was "cool" but also - I do believe that society has come to a point where people can open a bit more and not be so afraid to explore and learn just what makes them tick.

My mother also came out as Bi shortly before I did and I didn't know, she was afraid to tell me and I sure wasn't in any hurry to tell her.

We were out having a few beers one night, we caught each other checking out the same shooter girl and thats when it all humorously came out.

Sometimes I'm so bloody thankful for beer and laughter - some things wouldn't come out right otherwise.

Knight said...

I'm a little sad I wasn't a reader back when you first posted this. I think it is a great topic. I find myself trying to explain the scale all the time. Personally I don't consider myself bi because for the most part I tend to be attracted to guys but occasionally I am very attracted to a woman and I pursue it. So far those relationships have not lasted long. You never know though. It's just a matter of liking people for reasons more than their anatomy. Several of my close friends are bisexual. They have long term relationships with both men and women. Not at the same time of course. They just pick the person that makes them happy and that makes sense to me.

Malicious Intent said...

I think love is love and we try (as a society) to categorize it to much to fit our comfort level.

I seriously don't see what the big deal is about gay, straight or bi. If you love someone and are attracted to them, so be it! Who are we to say it is wrong.

I always say go pick on folks like pedophiles or poloticians. They are the sick ones!

Mojo said...

I have a theory (which means you get to hear it) on why (a) when the subject turns to bisexuality it's most often about women and (b) why people get turned on by the idea of girl on girl, and turned off by the idea of guy on guy. I think both phenomena sprouted from the same seed. To wit: we are conditioned to view women as more affectionate in general, so the idea of two women showing affection for each other -- including physically -- isn't quite so alien to us. We don't blink if two straight women greet each other with a hug, or even a kiss. It doesn't seem at all abnormal if that happens, and it's rare that anyone will even comment on it. If two straight men were to do the same thing, even they might feel a touch awkward.

But to address the question of whether or not people can be "truly" bi, a very dear friend of mine is bi and has found herself unable to stay in any kind of relationship. Her sexuality is probably not the sole reason for this, but it certainly contributes to it. The point being that I can't -- I don't -- believe she'd put herself through this for the sake of fashion.

It's heartbreaking to see... and more than once I've wished she had those kinds of feelings for me. I wouldn't make her choose. I couldn't.

Indigo said...

I think I might be gay but not 100% OK with it, due to the relationship I'm in at the moment, but that's my problem, if I see it as a problem... I hope I'm making sense?

Sabrae said...

So I read the post as I am getting caught up on all of your posts... Well I'm sure everyone has their opinion as to weather there is a thing as "bi" or just plain "gay" I went thru that transition... I liked dick... don't get me wrong... but I think it took me meeting my gf to realize that I just liked women better.. and since we have been together I can't say I even look at a man... They just kinda are "there" I was (well still am) legally married to a man (divorce in process) But I did also go thru that stage before I wanted to be with a girl that I went to the bars and did the whole making out with women for the attention of other men... GAY! I know this now :) But it took me 24years to know and to find that one person in life that just fit together perfectly for me :) And thus now married (not legally duh) and being together to realize I wouldn't have it anyother way. And even if god forbid something did happen between us I don't think I would EVER go back to men...

A. said...

I dated a woman in college not because I felt particularly queer, but because it's simply what you *do* at a women's college. Yes, this would be the DUG - dyke until graduation. I suspect that true bisexuals are rather rare. Add in the coolness factor of being bi, the hesitancy to commit/admit to full-time queerness, the hyper-sexualization of two women, and general confusion, and voila: lots of bis.

I will say that the lesbian community isn't always bi-friendly.

Allison

newbo said...

I never used to think anyone could be bisexual, the only people who seemed bi were people who were ashamed to be either completely hetero or homosexual. As if to keep their options open. I dated a bisexual man and just waved away, didn't really care cos i didn't think anyone could possibly be bi. Then I met my girlfriend, and now I'm rather confused about this bi situation now! I'm completely and utterly in love with her, but can imagine myself going back to men if we broke up. Am i bisexual? I have no idea, people keep asking me that question and i just don't know the answer.

newbo said...

There do however seem to fashionably gay women. Jodie Marsh (she's a british glamour model) and Linsday Lohan for example. Lesbian storylines are cropping up everywhere, like on Skins, Desperate Housewives have a little lesbian thing happening soon apparently. It appears it is now fashionable to be a lesbian not bisexual!

Dayna von Dyke said...

Alright. Fashionably bi and getting drinks, yes there are girls like that. Although I've never kissed anyone to get drinks. I just do. Get drinks and get kissed, separately.

I am truly bi. There are moments when I tip the scale and go absolutely queer but then I see a hot guy with the perfect abs and I'm back to being straight and my fear of ever having to go out to my family is gone. I can see myself in a long-term relationship with a man or a woman. Although I can also see myself cheating on man with another woman or vice versa.

There are others though who are bi-curious. Like my best friend. We were so drunk last night that she wanted me to teach her how to fuck a girl. Had she been sober she would've been grossed out. She's kissed girls but eh. She's not quite gay yet. Funny thing is, her curiosity made me realize that I was totally bisexual.